Hang Up the Phone, Example #496
We tell people all the time NEVER to make a charitable donation over the phone. And plenty of people who make their living in the telemarketing field then use their weapon of choice, the phone, to call me up and call me a heretic who hates everything about America.
And that's fine. I recognize that there are 2 or 3 people in America who call on behalf of charities, and do it with honor and integrity (ok, maybe 2 people), but I think the risks are simply too big for most donors and it's easier to make a blanket rule that no one should give over the phone. In many cases, the person calling is trying to scam you, and in the few cases where the caller represents a legitimate charity, the caller is usally a professional telemarketer who is contracted to make the calls on behalf of the non-profit, and for their work, gets to keep 50 to 95 cents on the dollar.
And of course, sometimes the caller is just a plain old criminal who is using the goodness of people's hearts to prey on them and rip them off, with no money actually getting to charities on the back end. This is called "stealing."
John Hargrove of Ohio is today's example of this. Mr. Hargrove, using a phone list he cultivated over the last 25 years, preyed on people sympathetic to veterans and solicited over the phone on behalf of "Veterans Source," "Veterans Network," and "Veterans Outreach" and had all of the checks sent to a private mailbox.
Not that it matters given that Mr. Hargrove was having the checks mailed directly to himself and cashing them for his own gain, but none of these organizations even exist. The number of victims that fell for Mr. Hargrove's bogus solicitations will be, according to the cops, "staggering."
People, please research your charities, give with your heads as well as your hearts, and remember that friends don't let friends give over the phone.
My phone lines are now open.
And that's fine. I recognize that there are 2 or 3 people in America who call on behalf of charities, and do it with honor and integrity (ok, maybe 2 people), but I think the risks are simply too big for most donors and it's easier to make a blanket rule that no one should give over the phone. In many cases, the person calling is trying to scam you, and in the few cases where the caller represents a legitimate charity, the caller is usally a professional telemarketer who is contracted to make the calls on behalf of the non-profit, and for their work, gets to keep 50 to 95 cents on the dollar.
And of course, sometimes the caller is just a plain old criminal who is using the goodness of people's hearts to prey on them and rip them off, with no money actually getting to charities on the back end. This is called "stealing."
John Hargrove of Ohio is today's example of this. Mr. Hargrove, using a phone list he cultivated over the last 25 years, preyed on people sympathetic to veterans and solicited over the phone on behalf of "Veterans Source," "Veterans Network," and "Veterans Outreach" and had all of the checks sent to a private mailbox.
Not that it matters given that Mr. Hargrove was having the checks mailed directly to himself and cashing them for his own gain, but none of these organizations even exist. The number of victims that fell for Mr. Hargrove's bogus solicitations will be, according to the cops, "staggering."
People, please research your charities, give with your heads as well as your hearts, and remember that friends don't let friends give over the phone.
My phone lines are now open.
posted by Trent Stamp at 10:39 AM
23 Comments:
Hi,
Good Work. I am looking for a banner link to your website. I have a blogspot site: www.gourmandstore.blogspot.com
My intent is to donate 3% of all sales profit from my site to charity. Haven't sold anything as yet..No one knows this site even exists...
Janya Barrish
hey now, i used to work for a theater, and they actually had staff directly on their payroll to do telefundraising. would it be ok to donate over the phone in that case, when it's honest-to-goodness employees rather than greedy contractors? (i adore your blog, by the way!)
Just wanted to let you know, I AM a professional fundraiser, and I check out this site frequently to see what it is saying about various charities. For everyone who is afraid to give over the phone, you shouldn't be if you have checked out the organization. In most states, professional fundraisers must have a background check and register with the attorney general's office before they can ever get on the phone. I had to. Also, we make seven dollars an hour, it's not like we are robbing people by that. It's barely over minimum wage, and we DO ACTUALLY WORK. I talk to over 400 people each and every day, 5 days a week, and I get yelled at, cursed at, hung up on, and called a thief, to raise money for Special Olympics. It's not an easy job, folks, and the fact is, we'll always have a job until enough people do the work we do for free. Any takers? Keep in mind, they need full time volunteers, in my dept, 15 people work 35 hours a week to fund half the events for the program. Now that is 5 days a week, 51 weeks out of the year. So, you all can get to coordinating that effort amongst yourselves if you like, but in the meantime, I'm still smilin' and dialin' and working VERY HARD for the very special people whom I serve. I don't just make a living, I MAKE A DIFFERENCE. And I'll NEVER EVER get rich off what I'm paid. I just thought for once you might look at the OTHER SIDE OF THE ARGUMENT.
and by the way, I forgot to mention, since I got a little bit riled while I was posting that last comment, this particular overpaid telefundraising thief, along with about 7 others from the office, thought you might enjoy knowing that tomorrow morning, yes, on our day off, we are going to guess what? The Special Olympics Regional Finals Bowling Tournament. AS VOLUNTEERS! I personally donate between 10 and 100 % of certain of my eBay listings to the charity I call for on a regular basis. This is done thru MissionFish. We really do care and are fairly fed up with being labeled as cold uncaring, money hungry individuals. Honestly, at least 3 of the single moms in my office will have their children on the Angel Tree this Christmas. Please take into consideration that those few bad apples you have read about are NOT the large majority of telefundraisers. Like any other occupation, there are always a few people who don't follow the rules, and take rather than give. I'm so proud of what I do every day. Our team is important to the intellectually disabled. I get so frustrated when I see blogs like this that point out the bad, but never the good. And while I'm on the subject, let me give you alittle bit of insight on the percentages everyone talks about. Keep in mind this is not just what I'm paid. This is also a building to call from, a computer and a telephone, and a monstrous telephone bill. And we do things the most cost efficient ways. We wouldn't be in business if we didn't. The actual profit margin for a telefundraising company is really not very much. For instance, we have to route the calls thru another state so that we pay interstate long distance rather that intrastate. It's cheaper. We fax instead of mail information and invoices whenever we can and we also YES OMG WE DO TAKE CREDIT CARD INFORMATION. These are COST CUTTERS. It is so much better to get a donation by CC than by fax, and either of those rather than by mail. Even with the merchant charge accounted for in a CC transaction, at least we don't have to remind donors that they made a pledge. It just gets paid immediately, straight to the organization. Fax vs mail is simple: no postage, no paper, no envelope. And I don't know about other companies, but where I work, the Special Olympics processes the donations, not us. You mail your check directly to them. That's so they can see for themselves exactly what is coming in for them. No one is stealing from them without their knowledge, because it goes STRAIGHT TO THEM. And also, if we don't meet our contract obligation to them, WE HAVE TO PAY THE DIFFERENCE. And we did, a few times. so you see, it's very, terribly important to us to keep costs down from a BUSINESS point of view, not to mention that EVERYONE INCLUDING US, wants more money to go to the program. I'll tell you who makes the real profit: the telephone companies. and don't think we don't shop around.if a telephone company would step up and be a hero and donate some long distance, that would be a GARGANTUAN chunk out of that percentage. even if they would donate just a few days a year it would make a big difference. well, i have indeed rambled on about this whole thing quite a bit now. i just now thought about apologizing for the strength of my feelings, but on second thought, I have decided against it. I AM proud of what I do, and what I've said here is the honest truth. I invite any and all comments to be emailed directly to me if you like to moonlitmeadowfairy@yahoo.com
Thanks for writing "Fairy" (or would it be Moonlit?). I'm glad you gave the other side of the story. Seriously. Your comments, while WAY too long, are definitely worth reading. I hope you'll keep checking in.
Thank you, Trent. And indeed I did ramble on for far too long. I had a lot to cover, though. Anyone who read the post might be interested to know that the athletes did very well today, and my husband and I attended the coaches' certification clinic for bowling, too!!! Yay! Now we can coach the athletes and participate more fully in the experience. I was close to tears more than once today, because to see these athletes reach their goals and have THEIR NAMES called out on the microphone was so touching. There isn't a whole lot of opportunity for the intellectually disabled, and they continue to suffer, unfortunately, from social discrimination and simple ignorance of the rest of society. The Special Olympics helps to change that for them. Thank you for not putting me down for sticking up for telefundraisers. I respect you immensely for that, Trent.
Big tent of ideas around here. I get to go first because it's my name on the door, but then anyone is welcome to play. I'm glad you'll be back. Maybe we'll find common ground. Congrats on the work with the kids.
I always say no to people calling me asking for money BECAUSE I HATE TO BE CALLED. The fact that you cannot be sure of who they are and how much of the money is actually going to the cause is secondary. The phone may be a cheap way to request funds for legitimate causes, but an impersonal phone call is a rude intrusion that I, a warm-hearted softie if ever there was one, cannot spare the time for.
I think there are some direct response programs that conduct a renewal or special appeal call to their house file of donors. These programs are often done well and return a 3:1 or 4:1 return on investment.
moonlitmeadowfairy, I accept that there are honest and efficient telefundraisers but even if I were to accept that most of them are, it's still beside the point.
You're calling _my_ phone, which I pay for for _my_own_ use, not for you to interrupt my dinner and, often, my work day. Do a great job, knock yourself out, and God bless you for the good that comes out of it.
But why not honor the do-not-call list? That is my notice to you that I'm not receptive to your interruptions. I give regularly to what and to whom I choose. I don't want or need a reminder. I listed my phone as do-not-call for a reason: I Do Not Want Your Calls.
OK, the law gives you an out. Do you really think I feel better about your interruption now, knowing that? What I do feel is resentment toward the client whose name you used, that you/they have chosen to hide behind that technicality and ignore my express wishes. When I next think of that organization, guess what I think of next. Want to guess how that affects my feelings of generosity? Why would you even _want_ to give me the opportunity to complain at you on the phone, when you have the information readily available (yup, the DNC list) to you? Just pass me by. You'll get less negative stuff directed at you on the phone, I'll get more time with my family, and your clients will get more of my money. And isn't that ultimately what you're in business for?
Dear bothered,
As a telemarketer who works in the for-profit sector (business to bussiness, I don't call you at home), I figured I should on this issue. I can certainly understand and appreciate Trent's take on this issue. It was this statement that bothered me though, pardon the pun.
"What I do feel is resentment toward the client whose name you used, that you/they have chosen to hide behind that technicality and ignore my express wishes. When I next think of that organization, guess what I think of next. Want to guess how that affects my feelings of generosity?"
This statement is ridiculous. Just because a phone call at home hurts your feelings, you are willing to downplay the amazing work done by an organization that helps the disabled. I would propose that it is not moonlit who is hiding behind a legal loophole, but rather it is you who is hiding their calloused outlook behind a DNC list.
Sorry, grammar error up there. I meant to say "weigh in on this issue."
"This statement is ridiculous. Just because a phone call at home hurts your feelings, you are willing to downplay the amazing work done by an organization that helps the disabled."
"Hurts my feelings"? "Willing to downplay..."? I said neither of those things. Please read it again. I did say "I give regularly" but perhaps you missed that part (or did you skip it because it didn't support you discounting what I had to say?) How is that "willing to downplay..." or "hiding behind..."? But it is a fact, that when an interrupter says "I'm calling for the so-and-so organization", few people, including myself, at that moment, stop to wonder how tight is the connection between that organization and the person who just interrupted our dinner? Ignore it if you like, call it or me names if it makes you feel better, but that's how it happens.
Thank you for not calling me at home, by the way. Plenty do, and I was speaking of and to those. So, hey, if that's not you, why the argumentative posture?
Trent,
Thank you for advising people not to donate over the phone. People should do their research by using sites like yours and THEN make a decision. These telefundraisers count on gullible people for impulse giving. Protect yourself and your money by hanging up the phone. I'm with Bothered on this one. There are many of us who share the same opinion. There should have never been any exceptions with the DNC. I can't tell you how many times I'm called (harassed really) by companies and charities.
Before I registered with the DNC list, I was receiving at least a dozen calls a day, I kid you not. These were mostly for organizations I do not support, for whatever reasons. I'm a college student, struggling like the rest, yet I consider donating extremely important and I feel that my generosity is taken advantage of.
Also, since we're all on this site, we understand the importance of researching charities. Sales pitches over the phone do not give you an unbiased opportunity for this. While I understand that you sometimes have to cram guilt down most people's throats to get them to act, I don't appreciate the fact the I give [relatively] amply and am still subjected to this.
Hi there. Ok, I'll let all of you who are bothered by phone calls in on a little secret. I will do this because in my opinion, it is a waste of the program money for me to call you at home OR at your business, even if there is a legal provision for it. Because those few who are SO bothered by it most likely are not going to give anyway. Although I HAVE gotten a donation several times after a person says they want off the list...it's amazing but it happens. Which is why you need to know THIS:
Here's how it works when a professional fundraiser like me calls you and you don't want to be called.
We are NOT required to put you on any DNC list. Also, just because you are on the National Do Not Call Registry, you are not excluded from calls by or for a charitable organization. BUT WE DO HAVE IN HOUSE DNC LISTS. But here's the trick: You can't hang up on us after telling us you don't want to be called again. we are doing you a favor in the eyes of the company by putting you on the in house dnc. Our company WILL place you on the DNC for our phone list IF you hold the line and let a coordinator double verify it. AND ONLY IF YOU DO. otherwise, TSRs would be putting everyone on the DNC who asks, and it is often not the person who actually makes financial decisions for the business we have called. You have to be the person in charge and you have to let a coordinator get on the line. Or there are a few magic words like lawsuit, attorney, and court. Those work. Not because you really have any legal reason to sue us, but because if you did we'd have to defend ourselves in court and that would be expensive.
I have occasionally put people on the in house DNC just because I genuinely felt sorry for them or I knew better than to ever call them again. but each time i do, i risk getting written up for it. So just do us all and yourselves a favor and hold the darn line a minute! This will get you off the list for at least 18 months. After that you'll have to do it again. Sorry. That's just the way it works.
Now then, YOU'RE WELCOME!
Thank you for this! Now I will be able to tell them go go away with authority!
The Duck says:
To all of you who give insight on these things, you are all a wonderful asset to the world of charity.
I too do not like calls. I have a cell phone with a 800 # so people can reach me for free all over the country (I am in politics, small politics, but still lots of calls). I think it is down right horrible what some people do.
Any thing, we as the public, can accomplish to prevent crooked behavior is great.
Let words be the weapon and knowledge the shield.
Hello all! This is a very interesting subject, and I think the author has a point. You really do not know who you are talking to over the phone, when dealing with charities. One of my first jobs when I was 18 was as a telemarketer for a supposed charity. I worked this job for about 2 months before I started asking questions, because it just seemed too wierd. they were providing thanksgiving dinners to the needy, and charging people 30$ a ticket to provide this. well, I knew someone who went to that meal, and they recieved a tv dinner. When I asked the director how much of what we made actually went to charity, she told me 3%, the rest went to other costs, AKA administration. the people like myself were paid a whopping 5$ an hour, part time. I have worked for other charities, and I have asked the same question. at least 3-6% goes to charity, and the rest goes to the dictators of the charity, the administration. this goes for police balls, Handicapped associations, and even some political fundraisers. If you gave a dollar to that guy who looks hungry on the street corner, I would have to say at least you know the needy are getting 100% of what you are giving, and is going to go a lot longer way than 5 cents.however, you can't blame the telemarketers here for defending themselves, and their jobs. Wouldn't want to take away their jobs, right? oh, and by the way, it does take several weeks or longer to be completely removed and put on the do not call list. For me, I just give directly. then I know where my money is going!
well i know it's probably too late since no one has replied to this in a while, but i just thought that for the record i would mention that after all expenses were paid, (which included over 1 MILLION long distance phone calls, the building we sat in to make the calls, and salaries, and the mailing expenses to get the pledge cards out) the percentage retained by the charity i call for was actually 47 percent last year, an increase of 1 percent from the year before, because like i said we try to cut the expenses. we should make that percentage even better this year ( we are on track to do so). we actually do check on things like this, and strive to continually improve it for the client. i don't know what company you called for, but mine really cares. of course it IS a business endeavor, but really, our main target is not people on this website, who are very generous to the charities of their choice; rather, we reach out to people who wouldn't really give unless they were asked to. I never mess with anyone who tells me they give directly, because what it is all about is acquiring funds for the client and I just tell them their support is appreciated and thank you.
Trent,
You are very sadly misinformed
about the world of telefundraising.
I work for one of the largest telefundraising firms in the country. That company raises funding for over 100 non profit
charities nationwide. Most of the
high profile well known non profits
are on their list of clients.
Those clients hire the company I work for to raise money for them because they can not get enough volunteers to devote the kind of time and energy it takes to raise
hundreds of thousands of dollars a year, some even need millions to run their programs.
Telefundraisers who work for the company I do do not have easy lives. I get paid minimum wage.
I do not get benefits. No health
insurance. No 401K. No paid vacation. I do not even get 40 hours a week. 35 at the most.
Workers also have quotas. If you
do not raise X number of dollars - you lose your job.
There is no such thing as job security.
Yes, we have laws that govern what we do. We have to go through extensive training regarding them.
Each state has differnt ones. Since the place I work for calls people in nearly every one, we have to know all of the different laws.
The company I work for employs over 500 people and each and ever one of them follows the law to the letter. We have to or we'd get fired. My company even tapes each and every phone call because we are consantly subject to review
by authorities and our clients to make sure all laws are followed.
The company I work for contracts
with each non profit to raise a specific amount and if they don't raise it they have to pay the remaining amount out of their own pocket.
So,even if each and every person
we called did not donate, and most of the don't - The charity would
still ge their money nd their good
work would go on.
It has happened in a few cases that the company I work for had
to pay a charity way more than what was actually raised.
So why do I work for minimum wage,
put up with being cursed at, hung upon, and having veryone accuse me falsely of being a crook ? because I believe I am making a difference.
I am helping dying child get a wish, I am helping a disabled child learn new skills to help them
lead a productive life, I am helping a vetran survive, etc.etc.
Several people seem to be in agreement that they give to charity
and do not want to be called to do so.
I am a telefundraiser for a non
profit. I hear people tell me the same thing every day. Not just 1 or 2 either. at least 30 percent of the people I call.
I am not the only telefundraiser
out there, and I assume others hear a lot of the same.
Thats about 100 responses of that nature a day per telefundraiser.
That amounts to hundreds of thousands of people who say they give to charity and do not want to be called.
Okay....here is a point to think about....if each person who felt that way actually did donate $100.00 a year to charity, charities would have no further
need to raise money, because they would have more than enough
to fund their programs.
Most people like others to think that they support charitable causes. However, the vast majority
do not actually donate to anything
other than their church.
Churches only rarely support other non profit causes...I've called lots of them, so I know...then when they do donate to another non profit it is a very small amount.
This article is ridiculous. I raise funds for Mothers Against Drunk Driving. The most that has ever been spent on payroll was 17%. I would love to know where you get this information about 50 to 95 cents going to the person calling for the charity.
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